Is Kreia Kae?

[Lordjedi]

I don't know if this has been done before but I'm gonna have a little debate that is about if you think Kreia is Kae or not. I do. Becuase of the fact she and Kae were said to be Revan's Masters. Both were exiled, Kreia said that it is because of Kae gave birth, but Kreia lies...alot. And when Kreia faces 3 masters Vrook says "I thought you died in the Mandalorian Wars" to Kreia, and Kreia said Kae died in the Mandalorian Wars. If Kreia is 50 and the handmaiden is 25 that means Kreia was 25 when she had the Handmaiden if she did. Atton also once said that "It takes hard living to get creases like that". Also the fact that when you Train the Handmaiden into a Jedi she says "Betrayal". The other thing is how did Atris get hold of the Handmaiden. This leads into the disscussion about is Atris an Echani because Yusanis gave all his Children up to Atris. Including the handmaiden. They Handmaiden sisters also say that "She is shameful she honors the face of her mother". They may say that because of the fact that Kae/Kreia went to the Mandalorian Wars which Atris says is bad . Kreia also doesn't want the Exile to fall in Love with the Handmaiden if male. This shows she might be protecting the Handmaiden.

[JCarter426]

I think Kreia is definitely Kae. Mr Avellone all but confirmed it. Let me reiterate the evidence:

*Both were exiled.
*Both trained Revan.
*Both fought in the Mandalorian Wars.
*Both were beleived to have died during the Mandalorian Wars.
*Kreia "knew" Brianna's mother.
*Kae was said to be beautiful, as was Kreia.
*Brianna is said to "bear the face of her mother". The only difference between Brianna and the other handmaidens' apoearance is that Brianna has braids. So does Kreia.
*Even though Kreia is only fifty, she has white hair. It seems to be an Echani trait, one that Brianna shares.
*Kreia's beliefs echo the teachings of the Echani--specifically her views on truth being expressed through combat.

See: The Something Awful Forums - Star Wars Knights of the Old Republic II - Because We Hate Endings

[Lordjedi]

I stated most of those. We also know in Cut Content Kreia was supposed to take her hood of infront of Vrook I suppose to show here true indenity. Kae.
Off Topic: Doesn't Something Awful make you pay to use their forums.

[The Crusader]

You bring up some good points, Carter. But still, for some reason, (maybe just a gut feeling) I don't think Kreia is Arren Kae. If they haven't confirmed it by now... but what do I know?

[Lordjedi]

They haven't confirmed it yet.

[Darth_Voldemort]

You know, I just thought of a theory, probably incorrect, but it could explain a lot.

Kae/Kreia went to the Mandalorian Wars, where she fought and supposedly "died" at Malachor, when in truth she stumbled upon the Trayus Academy, thus birthing Darth Traya. She stayed there, training Nihilius and Sion, up until they betrayed her and cast her out.

Just my thoughts. Feel free to disagree.

[Lordjedi]

Originally Posted by Darth_Voldemort

You know, I just thought of a theory, probably incorrect, but it could explain a lot.

Kae/Kreia went to the Mandalorian Wars, where she fought and supposedly "died" at Malachor, when in truth she stumbled upon the Trayus Academy, thus birthing Darth Traya. She stayed there, training Nihilius and Sion, up until they betrayed her and cast her out.

Just my thoughts. Feel free to disagree.

Actually I was thinking the same thing But then I thought of her past and her teachings that vialoted the code.

[JCarter426]

Originally Posted by Lordjedi

I stated most of those. We also know in Cut Content Kreia was supposed to take her hood of infront of Vrook I suppose to show here true indenity. Kae.
Off Topic: Doesn't Something Awful make you pay to use their forums.

Yeah, I know--I just figured I'd list them all.

I hadn't thought about Kreia taking off her hood...that does make sense.

And yeah, they make you pay, but you don't have to pay to view the page.

Originally Posted by Revan91

You bring up some good points, Carter. But still, for some reason, (maybe just a gut feeling) I don't think Kreia is Arren Kae. If they haven't confirmed it by now... but what do I know?

Well, when asked, Mr Avellone said something along the lines of "can't comment, but good catch", and then winked repeatedly (I imagine). I'm betting that Obsid was going there, but ran out of time. And they can't comment on it now because the KOTOR Comic crew is in charge of that era now.

Originally Posted by Darth_Voldemort

Kae/Kreia went to the Mandalorian Wars, where she fought and supposedly "died" at Malachor, when in truth she stumbled upon the Trayus Academy, thus birthing Darth Traya. She stayed there, training Nihilius and Sion, up until they betrayed her and cast her out.

It's said as much in the game. Well, she didn't train Sion or Nihilus until much later, but she was at the Trayus Academy training Sith when the Jedi thought she was dead. However, I always thought she didn't find the Trayus Academy until after K1, but nevertheless it would make sense if she found it earlier than that.

The fact that she "died" makes me suspect she was at Malachor. But why would Revan try to kill his former master? Becuase it's the way of the Sith? Or did Kreia trick the Order into thinking she had died there after the fact? This brings up even more questions...but enough of that.

We may never know one way or the other, but I'm 99% sure that Obsid was planning on it. There's just way too much evidence to ignore it.

[Darth_Voldemort]

You know, the more I think about it, I find so many pieces that just don't add up. Kreia found the Trayus Academy AFTER the Mandalorian Wars (did some research), when she went to look for Revan on Malachor. Thus, my last theory has now been rendered incorrect. However, it could be possible that Kae was able to escape during the activation of the MSG, and then be presumed dead, when she was really in hiding?

Also, I do not remember Revan trying to kill her. Then again, I usually skip most conversations with Kreia anyways.

[Jedijax]

There's one fact to take into consideration: It was never stated Kreia fought in the final battles of the Mandalorian Wars, so the possibility of her not being at Malachor V during the activation of Bao's hellish trinket exists.

I would never buy Kreia/Arren would "follow" Revan, it just isn't in her character to follow others, I think she was doing to him what she did to The Jedi Exile, sharing half truths, manipulating circumstances and characters around to achieve her own ends.

Regardless, there is a serious question to consider: If Kreia is, indeed mother to Brianna, then she would have sustained sexual intercourse with Yusanis, for whatever her reasons, and then jumped onboard Revan's little band of dissidents to smash the mandalorians. This act may seem quite pedestrian and common, yet, what if she was already manipulating events, and making the Echani general fall in love with her merely to get him to fight for Revan's cause indirectly?? It can be stated Yusanis joined the war effort after it had raged for some time, and he and his forces were an important addition; based on known references and facts it is almost certain. If such was the case, and if you take Kreia's comments on Revan into consideration, it looks like she was dissapointed on her old padawan, as if she expected him to do or not do some specific tasks, to think in some particular manner. Kreia's/Arren's manipulations would be hinted by the veiled suggestions of her following Revan out of a romantic interest, when she was actually using him from the very beggining.

Another way to sustain such a theory would be Revan was well known to be a deceptive, manipulative force during the later stages of the Mandalorian Wars and the first half of the Jedi Civil War. It would be logical if he learned such traits from Kreia, as she was his master as a Jedi and quite probably as a neophyte Dark Side aprrentice. This would make Revan's failure credible, as he would not have been the original mastermind of the plot, but a resilient pawn turned player after his discovery of the treachery.

I think such a development would explain much of the era's enigmatic and seemingly ilogical situations and resolutions, as well as make both games more cohesive and interesting.