Woman given a ticket for no hablo englis?

[Smitty025]

Originally Posted by NiteStryker

Illegal U-Turn and not carrying her license on her while driving. Thats 2 things wrong.

I was referring to the situation Nemmerle brought up in which a person might be considered to be impeding an investigation if they did not speak the language.


I should add though, if you follow that example foreign tourists whose fluency in English might not be adequate would also be guilty of impeding an investigation.

Originally Posted by Mr. Pedantic

Fine, fine, fine. I can see I am in the minority. I'll shut up now. However, I still stand by what I said.

Don't give up brother! FIGHT THE GOOD FIGHT!

[Cheese!]

Originally Posted by Afterburner

Good. All government documents at every single level in the United States should be English only. Speak your language at home or with whoever else you want, I wouldn't ever try to force someone to unlearn their language. However, if you are living in the U.S., a country in which 99% of people speak English, you should learn it too. It needs to be this country's official language.

If I move to Germany I expect to speak German, if I move to Mexico I expect to speak Spanish, if I move to China I expect to speak Chinese, and if anyone moves to the U.S. I expect them to speak English.

I agree completely.

I have no problem with people speaking Spanish. I have no problem with people speaking ANY other language. But when I go to a business and the person has no clue what I'm saying, there's a problem.

[Rich19]

That's ridiculous. She deserves the ticket for the minor crimes, but not for the language. Unless I'm mistaken it's not a crime to not understand English. The police should stick to enforcing the laws, rather than enforcing the laws and their opinion of immigrants. Would you like to live in a country whose police give people tickets for being non-white? I agree that the woman ought to make an effort to speak English, but allowing the police to abuse their power based on their opinions is not a road I'd like to go down.

[Crazy Wolf]

En los Estados Unidos, es posible vivo sin Ingles, pero ingles es la idioma de la "Constitución", "Declaratorio de Independencia", y otra textos importante de Estados Unidos. No es ilegal si tu no habla ingles, pero es muy dificulte y es débil por la integración en la comunidad Estadounidense. Ingles es fácil por una Espanofone, Ingles tiene mucha palabras de Español o Latín.

La policía es muy tonto, pero si tu vive en la EE.UU. 20 años y no habla ingles, es posible tu no muy inteligente.



(sorry for my terrible Spanish)


See how annoying that is? I don't think they should be ticketed for not speaking the language, but it would save a lot of trees if, for example, the California DMV didn't print it's handbooks and texts in English, Armenian, Spanish, Russian, Chinese, Korean, Vietnamese, Punjabi, and Tagalog.

Also, as referenced above, all of the founding Government documents are in English. To facilitate better understanding of what the Founding Fathers meant, it helps to keep things in their original language. (Example of translations causing confusion and strife: Christianity, going from Aramaic to Greek or Aramaic to Hebrew to Greek then to Latin then to French, English, German, Spanish, Romanian, Slavic languages, and then to East Asian and African languages).

[Rich19]

Originally Posted by Crazy Wolf

En los Estados Unidos, es posible vivo sin Ingles, pero ingles es la idioma de la "Constitución", "Declaratorio de Independencia", y otra textos importante de Estados Unidos. No es ilegal si tu no habla ingles, pero es muy dificulte y es débil por la integración en la comunidad Estadounidense. Ingles es fácil por una Espanofone, Ingles tiene mucha palabras de Español o Latín.

La policía es muy tonto, pero si tu vive en la EE.UU. 20 años y no habla ingles, es posible tu no muy inteligente.



(sorry for my terrible Spanish)


See how annoying that is? I don't think they should be ticketed for not speaking the language, but it would save a lot of trees if, for example, the California DMV didn't print it's handbooks and texts in English, Armenian, Spanish, Russian, Chinese, Korean, Vietnamese, Punjabi, and Tagalog.

Also, as referenced above, all of the founding Government documents are in English. To facilitate better understanding of what the Founding Fathers meant, it helps to keep things in their original language. (Example of translations causing confusion and strife: Christianity, going from Aramaic to Greek or Aramaic to Hebrew to Greek then to Latin then to French, English, German, Spanish, Romanian, Slavic languages, and then to East Asian and African languages).

"I'm a cop and I think people speaking only Spanish are annoying (because this country's language is English), so I'm going to give this Spanish person a ticket."

"I'm a cop and I think SUV drivers are annoying (because SUVs are unnecessarily bad for the environment), so I'm going to give this SUV driver a ticket."

Anyone object to the second cop's way of thinking?

[Crazy Wolf]

Uh, dude, did you even read my post? I'm not saying they should be ticketed, but I am saying they should learn the language.

I object to both statements in your post, go quote someone who disagrees with you if you want to argue.

[Rich19]

Hmm, I skimmed over it and appear to have missed the important bit. My bad, although the point I was trying to make still stands to other people in this thread.

[Junk angel]

Want to speak your language? Fine. And when you're arrested for failing to comply with police at a traffic stop because you've wilfully kept yourself unable to do so I'll weep sad sad tears for you. Really.

Ignorance of law does not excuse. Kinda old standard that is applicable here.

So the main points - was the citation an obvious abuse of power - yes. A citation or fine for the u-turn would be fine, a citation for being a non-speaking-english driver not.

Though does the US really have no official language? I was always under the impression that English was the official language. Considering that court proceedings, laws, various school exams etc are in English. Not to mention that it's thought as a first language.

As to immigration and language. The Euro system seems pretty solid in this. In order to attain real nationality you also have to past a language test after a certain amount of time living in the country. It's pretty easy, but still...

Of course, if there's a sizeable minority in an area they usually get some perks. Like teaching in their native language, court proceedings in their native language (or at least a translator), but they are still thought the official state language in school alongside with their native one.

[Admiral Donutz]

As others said, where in the law does it say it's forbidden not to speak or understand English or what mimum level it should be at? I don't think there is such a law, is there?

Originally Posted by Afterburner

I agree that you should have to speak English to live in the U.S., but I don't think cops giving out tickets for it is the right way to go, and I don't see how they at all have the authority to do so right now. The cops that gave out these tickets definitly need to be punished somehow for simply not following their own regulations, unless this is actually a law on the books that I'm unaware of.

I agree, foreigners should be encouraged to speak the language and intergrate. Make them pass a test/exam tht shows they atleast have some very basic understanding of the country and language. Some basic enough skills like telling your name, age, location and buying something in a shop would be a nice "minimum requirement". When they do move here, point them towards languages classes. If they wish to settle here permanently you'd could raise the bar a bit so they have a basic understanding of the language, if they are only here for a year (or two) it matters less.

But it shouldn't be illegal to not be able (or willing) to speak the language. It may mean you won't be able to participate in society though as you can't expect people to approach you in your language. It's nice if they do but not required.

Language tests/exam became part of the DUtch immigration requirements relatively recentlyy to promote intergration, which in turn should increase the chanches of the immigrants playing an "active" role in the society.

Edit:

Kunkle said his department's computer system for citations has a pull-down menu that includes a law requiring drivers of commercial vehicles to speak English. The chief said he believes the federal law was misapplied to local drivers of private vehicles.

EIther the cop was stupid as hell and didn't figure that there is no such law that forces drivers of privare vehicles to speak English or he knew better but thought to apply this "law" wrongfully anyway because he was annoyed be this non-english speaking driver. And this times nearly 40? Heh.

[NiteStryker]

Originally Posted by Smitty025

I was referring to the situation Nemmerle brought up in which a person might be considered to be impeding an investigation if they did not speak the language.

I would say thats a stretch but I'd agree with it.

Originally Posted by Smitty025

I should add though, if you follow that example foreign tourists whose fluency in English might not be adequate would also be guilty of impeding an investigation.

Well then dont come to my country, not speak the language, and get caught up in an investigation.

Originally Posted by Crazy Wolf

En los Estados Unidos, es posible vivo sin Ingles, pero ingles es la idioma de la "Constitución", "Declaratorio de Independencia", y otra textos importante de Estados Unidos. No es ilegal si tu no habla ingles, pero es muy dificulte y es débil por la integración en la comunidad Estadounidense. Ingles es fácil por una Espanofone, Ingles tiene mucha palabras de Español o Latín.

La policía es muy tonto, pero si tu vive en la EE.UU. 20 años y no habla ingles, es posible tu no muy inteligente.

Originally Posted by Crazy Wolf

See how annoying that is? I don't think they should be ticketed for not speaking the language, but it would save a lot of trees if, for example, the California DMV didn't print it's handbooks and texts in English, Armenian, Spanish, Russian, Chinese, Korean, Vietnamese, Punjabi, and Tagalog.

Plus, if I recall, most street signs are in English.