Marriage
 

So what's your opinion of the whole thing?

Me personally...well...I can't see myself even considering marriage in any sense to anyone until I'm at least in my 30s, specifically after I've hopefully started a good career and can generally support myself.

I mean...marriage isn't a requirement by any means for happiness or commitment, but it is a legal binding of commitment so I think I should have as much time and experience as possible before signing off on it. What do you think? More specifically, what are your conditions for a successful marriage?

Re: Marriage
 

I can't really say much more than when you're ready and find the right person. It isn't for everyone and no one should be forced into it.

I think you need stability, in your job and your personal life. You need to settle down before deciding to settle down.

Re: Marriage
 

Marriage makes it harder to split up with somebody. I have no idea why it's even a thing.

Re: Marriage
 

Exactly. Marriage is for people who enjoy court proceedings.

Re: Marriage
 

It is the ultimate way of saying "right, I'm done with life now. How long until I die?"

Re: Marriage
 

Never underestimate someone's ability to disappoint you.

Re: Marriage
 

Re: Marriage
 

Re: Marriage
 

Re: Marriage
 

Goody, there isn't a single thing in your post that cannot be done just as well without getting married.

Re: Marriage
 

You're not obligated to do anything other than sleep, breathe, consume food, aqcuire shelter, acquire currency for said food and shelter, take a dump and do all of these except acquiring shelter on a regular basis. Hell you don't have to do any of that either if you're suicidal and don't really give two flying fucks about staying alive.

It's a matter of preference. Nothing comes without it's pros and cons. Whether that's being married/unmarried or something else.

Personally, the problem with getting married/finding a soulmate/etc., is how do you find this 'right one' or your 'dream girl/guy' or whatever you prefer to call them? I can't really say I have the uncanny ability that everybody seems to possess to judge someone simply at first glance or over a cup of tea/coffee. For that matter given how fickle people can be, how do you judge someone even within a year?

Re: Marriage
 

Going by the number of failed marriages, I'd say the ability to accurately judge someone at first sight isn't that common.

Re: Marriage
 

And at the same time there are those that ended up better. If Goody is being truthful on the last page (no offense Goody), there's at least him. What do I gather from that?

Re: Marriage
 

Perhaps he just got lucky, with millions of men and women pairing off someone's bound to. Or perhaps there's something in between psychic powers and total ignorance, so that while there's still an element of luck some people are more likely to get lucky than others.

Re: Marriage
 

It is true that marriage is not a requirement for a contented partnership but being committed is and marriage is just a statement of commitment to one another. I am sure there are other ways of making that statement without all the legal issues but I suppose if your going to to do it you might as well do it right.

As for finding the right person and knowing them when you find them. Well I am not sure what to tell you as it can happen at any time or never. I only hope you guys do find them. Someone said and I think it was Billy Conolly that we are a screwed up so find someone who is just as screwed up as you and be happy. I guess I was lucky.

Re: Marriage
 

Re: Marriage
 

Luck of the draw and finding somebody 'as screwed as you'?

I really wish I didn't have to rely on probability for anything. It's the world's way of telling 'fuck you' even when you do your best and try to make the best of the cards you've been dealt.

As for the second statement that seems a dark way to look at it for somebody who is so happily married.

Re: Marriage
 

I hope that is not the case but I fear you might be right.

Re: Marriage
 

I like the way Goody puts it. Cheers for that :cheers:
For what I've seen, some married couples seem to do amazing, others not so much. It's just, as with anything else, a thing that differs from person to person.

I personally don't really like the whole marriage institution for myself, as in I don't see myself getting married at any point because I feel I can have a good relationship with someone without a legal binding and also because I'm polygamous.
Right now I'm going great with a person from Texas who hopefully will come visit by the end of summer, and neither of us really like the whole marriage thing, but we still consider ourselves a couple and you know... May or may not have hypothetical future plans.

The only reason I would probably get married would be for the ceremony... A huge, flamboyant, overly-produced ceremony and I just adore a nice wedding dress =p

Re: Marriage
 

I would not say it is a dark statement more of repeating of a observation made by someone else. I love my wife but I am under no illusion about her or myself. We both have flaws that may make other people run a mile if we were single but together we suit each other.
If you guys are looking for miss perfect then your screwed because she is a fairy tale but it your looking for someone who will compliment you then you have a real chance of finding miss right.

Re: Marriage
 

Maybe dark wasn't the right word. In retrospect, I misconstrued the saying to mean that both members in the couple would be equally pathetic, so naturally I just thought that's a sardonic way of saying don't try to do something like 'fall in love' with somebody who has a higher social standing than you and/or is richer or a lot more smarter than yourself. I didn't realize you meant what you said in this post.

Maybe not 'Miss Perfect', but is it really so wrong to make a request for the best?

Re: Marriage
 

It's a rather sad thing to want the best, actually.... 7 billion people, and only one can be the best. If your criteria for love is that they have to be the best, rather than a decent, loving, compassionate person with strengths that compliment your weaknesses and vice versa, then as the world population increases your chances of falling in love go down.

Which seems like the opposite of the way it should work. ;)

Re: Marriage
 

Best within ones surroundings and that one is capable of belonging with. Not actually out of the world population. I may as well start counting possible alien species in the entire universe and a supposed multiverse to consider at that level of vanity.

And I never actually defined what the absolute best/perfect actually would be for me or anyone else. Maybe the best that I hope for is someone who is decent, loving and compassionate. Anything else that I could benefit from would simply be icing on the cake.

Re: Marriage
 

One can always hope for the best person they know and that significantly reduces the problem, yes. The best for you and that you know of may be entirely as Goody defined it though - they're not necessarily better than you are when you start cutting things down like that. :)

Re: Marriage
 

That is Ok things are so easily misunderstood when people are not speaking face to face.
I understand why you question whether it is proper to fall for someone richer or smarter or of a higher social standing but for me this would have never been a concern. If you love each other then that really should have nothing to do with it. What would matter is the life that you build as a couple.
It is not wrong but be careful that you spend so much time looking that you forget to have fun and live. If she is out there and your meant to be together then you will eventually bump into each other.

I was friends with my wife before we started going out and that really helped and after 20 years of being together we still have fun and live ;)

Re: Marriage
 

I'm not so sure. It's obvious that no poor sob is going to end up with a rich executive in a multibillion multinational firm but I still don't get the feeling we can cut it so close that there would be no disparity at all. Maybe it's just a result of me having been more acquainted with people who had undergone arranged or relatively 'watched over' marriages. I don't know if I'm willing to put that much faith into another individual to not have a disagreement over the disparity between us especially when people love making petty fat/ugly/stupid jokes. I wouldn't really mind them but people tend to do it more often than I believe they should which makes me a bit concerned as to how one wouldn't call out even on the most insignificant disparities.

Well let's just say that I've met people who are married and above the age of 50 who have their doubts about such situations. These people don't abuse each other and perform as a married couple should but they don't seem to hold the faith that it's love per se. More like the requisite amount of friendship and cooperation required for such a union and undertaking all the responsibility's born as a result. Maybe I again misconstrued what they were saying or don't know the full extent of their relationship. They did seem to believe that with such disparity, however, somebody was bound to get the shaft IF somebody withing the relationship thought themselves better or more deserving because they were something like having an IQ of 9001 (a joke) and/or Mr./Ms. World (an exaggeration to give you the point) or were making most of the money out of the family.

And that isn't necessarily wrong either. Maybe you messed up your significant others intelligent decisions with your not so intelligent ones and they get fed up with you but you simply can't help it because the larger picture doesn't occur to you until it's too late. Or maybe they've always been told throughout their life that they were very attractive to the point that even though they tried to let go of their vanity, the way they act quite often implies you should worship them and even if they try to apologize for it and seem sincere they can't help it because it has practically been beaten into their subconscious by that point which quite often gets you in a bad situation.

Then there is the stereotype of the bread winner vs. the home maker. Even in the more liberal western society, take an example, say, how many times would you see a woman who is significantly taller than a man, earns the money and takes charge of family matters as opposed to the man who would do all the household chores and make sure that the woman was comfortable on their off time. It's doubtful all of this would happen especially altogether, given that men are genetically predisposed to be taller and stronger as opposed women unlike spiders or praying mantis'. But that was just part of the example and I digress. Point is who wouldn't make it a point of pointing that out. I'm pretty sure even there, there are still many people who make a big deal out of who wears the shoes in a relationship and who should. Wouldn't that put any kind of stress on the couple? Or wouldn't it have bred any biases within the individuals throughout their lives that becomes really hard to shake off despite all logic and impairs their functioning within the relationship? If a little degree of prejudice is present, I think all this would happen unless the two were pretty even. If the woman is the one in charge, it would put stress on the man that he's 'not a man' because he doesn't perform the particular responsibility's of a man. If the man is in charge, it's possible he won't give the woman a break 'because she doesn't do a job'.

Maybe yours is a more open society or you yourself are in a better relationship that such disparity wouldn't matter and such issues are inconsequential to at least you if not the people around you.

I am not sure I should really say anything either way since believing love will prevail is really more a matter of faith than logic.

Re: Marriage
 

There will be times in a marriage that it will be like going through the motions and not seem like love that is kind of the point. You have that faith in your partner that even if things are rough you get through them together.
In this big old world there are so many different cultures, religions and races that to actually define what a marriage is to me will be totally different to someone else. I see marriage and for that matter love as a feeling that really can break down culture, religion, race and even class if you are 2 people who want to spend your lives together and no one should be allowed to tell you no. I do not believe in things like arranged marriage or demeaning your wife by treating her as nothing less than my equal.

All I will say my friend is that to find someone you have live life if you don't you won't so don't sit at home feeling sorry for what will never be because that is the best way to make sure it will never be.

You are right it is a matter of faith but both faith in yourself to know that you will make someone happy and faith in that person to make you happy.

Re: Marriage
 

They married you in the first place. If you were that unequal, they'd probably not have done so - bar that you had something they didn't that they thought made up for it. (Young women marrying old men for their money for instance.)

Arranged marriages stuff things up, sure. And assholes will always grab any weakness they can see to hurt you with - regardless of whether the disparity in some area is that great and is or isn't matched by a similar disparity in some other area on their part.

Re: Marriage
 

Depends on how you look at it, personally I love my life as a team and it's only gotten better having lived together for a few years. You need to make sure you have someone who can support you and shore up your weaknesses while you do the same for them. You have each others' backs through thick and thin! Honestly my (now husband, after the 8 year home trial period) is my best friend, we care for each other, and so many stomach butterflies! The point is, a marriage that survives isn't just about the contract, it's in your compatibility in the company of another person. The contract can come later when you are absolutely sure of your decision.

Re: Marriage
 

Marriage is a legal acknowledgement and commitment to a relation. I took my chanche and got married last year. It will be my only marriage, either because we stay together (I'd like to believe we can), or if it was not meant to be (??) I'd simply not bother ever marrying again.

Their is a bonus though: if my wife naturalizes to Dutch citizenship she can keep her own nationality. If we were simply in a commited relationship, then upon naturalisation she would lose her original citizenship. Given up citizenship of any nationality would be a waste, I'd rather obtain dual nationality for the both of us (but for me to become Thai I'd we'd need to migrate to there and their naturalisation laws are a bit more strict...).