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wjlaslo

June 11th, 2008 04:43 PM

Re: 17 pounder

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bikewer (Post 4382031)

The one fellow who's appeared on a couple of the History channel shows (can't recall his name) said that a Tiger could take out 3 Shermans. "But there was always a fourth..."

The actual average in the war was seven enemy tanks (of every type) for one tiger. I think it was six for a Panther, and about eighteen for a King Tiger.

LegiOn[PL]

June 11th, 2008 06:05 PM

Re: 17 pounder

Yea..since Germans were defending mostly all the times...and those tanks were not attacking one next to each other.For example...At the battle of Stashów,ONE T34/85 took out like 3 or 4 Tigers II-that dosn't mean that for one T34/85 there were like 3 Tigers II,besides that..History channel tells bullshit instead of history.:rolleyes:

Von Mudra

June 11th, 2008 10:08 PM

Re: 17 pounder

People never think.... There were RARELY, EVER cases of Tigers that were lone wolfs. Wittmann was a major exception, and it was only during one battle, hell, even Carius and Knispel didn't do that. Most Tigers fought in 4 tank squads, and often 2 squads worked together. This meant that each covered the other.... Sure, it may take 5 shermans to get 1 around that Tiger, but will it survive when the tiger's 3 buddies shoot at him? Same with Panthers and King Tigers and every other tank ever used by any side. Lone Wolfs were RARE, extremely RARE. 4-5 tank squads were the norm, so they could cover each other.

Now, onto the issue of the 17lber used in North Africa, yeah, it was used, though too late to do much good, and the Tigers mostly faced the americans.

Eightba11

June 11th, 2008 11:04 PM

Re: 17 pounder

Too bad that evidence shows that the allies not only outproduced, but outFOUGHT the axis, as well--maybe not initially, but as they wizened up to the process by which their enemies operated.....

[WDW]Megaraptor

June 12th, 2008 06:49 AM

Re: 17 pounder

Quote:

Originally Posted by Von Mudra (Post 4382582)

People never think.... There were RARELY, EVER cases of Tigers that were lone wolfs. Wittmann was a major exception, and it was only during one battle...

And Wittman attacked Villiers-Bocage with 3-4 other Tigers IIRC, he just left them behind when he went off on his famous charge.

Von Mudra

June 12th, 2008 08:45 AM

Re: 17 pounder

As I recall it was 2 Tigers and 2 Pz4H. And Wittman was an idiot for that attack on the village. Stormed in with no infantry support and lost both Tigers, which were recovered later.

luftwaffe.be

June 12th, 2008 10:12 AM

Re: 17 pounder

Quote:

Most Tigers fought in 4 tank squads, and often 2 squads worked together.

and oftenly, 1/2 tigers where standing still because of an engine malfuction ...

hslan.Faust

June 12th, 2008 10:21 AM

Re: 17 pounder

Quote:

Originally Posted by a guy (Post 4383182)

and oftenly, 1/2 tigers where standing still because of an engine malfuction ...

and the shermans nick was "ronson"...

-=TB=- HORROR

June 12th, 2008 12:30 PM

Re: 17 pounder

Quote:

Well, yeah. Their argument seems to be, "We had such uber weapons and well-trained troops that no one should have been permitted to find ways to defeat them. No fair fighting a war we can't win!"

sounds like any war the americans did and lost after ww2 :)

[WDW]Megaraptor

June 12th, 2008 02:48 PM

Re: 17 pounder

Quote:

Originally Posted by Von Mudra (Post 4383066)

As I recall it was 2 Tigers and 2 Pz4H. And Wittman was an idiot for that attack on the village. Stormed in with no infantry support and lost both Tigers, which were recovered later.

Not according to this page, although if you've got another source please post.

Quote:

More crucially Wittmann noted that there were few German forces of substance in the immediate vicinity, and that the British column would have had a clear and unobstructed route though to the town of Caen. He himself had only six serviceable Tigers at his disposal: these were numbers 211 (commanded by SS-Ostuf. Jürgen Wessel), 221 (SS-Ustuf. Georg Hantusch), 222 (SS-Uscha. Kurt Sowa), 223 (SS-Oscha. Jürgen Brandt), 233 (SS-Oscha. Georg Lötzsch, and 234 (SS-Uscha. Herbert Stief); of these six vehicles, 233 had track damage and SS-Ostuf. Wessel was not present, having departed for the front to receive orders.

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