Accuracy of Mobile 88s
 

Hi,

during a round of El Al today, I really started wondering about the mobile 88s. For some godforsaken reason, they seem (this may just be me smoking crack or having a bad day) to have far more deviation than the stationary ones, or maybe I'm just trying to engage at greater distances.

It really seemed to me that I wasn't hitting squat, while I tend to have a much higher hit rate with the stationaries--and no, before someone makes a smartass comment, my halftrack wasn't in the process of sliding down the hill.

Considering the mad high velocity of 88 shells, it seems to me they should be a lot more exact than they are over distances, especially on maps like El Al, with tank battles over wide open spaces and no real hiding places to go "hull down" with mobile 88s. Anyone?

Re: Accuracy of Mobile 88s
 

I think the reason for that is that fh is a "pop" mod.
They sometimes tent to balance stuff in a strange vehicles, maybe to make the mod more fun for n00bs :D

Re: Accuracy of Mobile 88s
 

... Lobo and other devs have said before - FH does not do this. How many times do they have to say? Sometimes there is a little miscoding here and there but generally the mod is leaning towards realism. What you said is absolute rubbish - not trying to flame you but the devs have said it before.

Fuzzybunny - I myself have not noticed this. On Aberdeen I have scored succesive kills time and time again using that mobile 88. I find that I have to aim a little bit above the targets but not miles above. Generally though they seem extremely accurate to me ...

Re: Accuracy of Mobile 88s
 

What? they ALL have said some things may be changed, NOT MISCODED to balance it!

Re: Accuracy of Mobile 88s
 

You misunderstand - when I said 'miscoded' I was implying that maybe a few bugs have come through here and there.

Re: Accuracy of Mobile 88s
 

OK, fair enough--I was just soliciting opinions on the issue (which may not even be one--I'd be completely willing to accept that it's just me with a lot of bad luck.) I just reeeeally started wondering on both Aberdeen an El Al whether the damn things were as accurate as the stationary 88s, since my shots seemed to drop all over the place except on enemy tanks (with the exception of the single Sherman I hit frontally, and it didn't even smoke...)

..and I'm really not _that_ miserable a shot. Usually.

Re: Accuracy of Mobile 88s
 

Well who is talking rubbish here?
HOW COME HALFTRUCKS TAKE TwO TANK SHELLS NOW? (from medium tanks, KT still 1s1k)
When you ask the devs you get the answer "...so more people use them"
And thats JUST the proof that they do.
Not that it is bad in all cases, but in some like the 88 it is. (Dunno if the 88 is balanced though.)

Re: Accuracy of Mobile 88s
 

The halftracks are not coded that way "so more people use them." It is to simluate the tendency of some AP rounds to pass right through non-critical parts of the vehicle, without causing the spalling and other lethal effects that might occur in a more heavily armored vehicle. It's not a perfect solution, but it is not just an arbitrary distortion either.

Re: Accuracy of Mobile 88s
 

i have had the same problem but im just shit so thats my problem!

Re: Accuracy of Mobile 88s
 

I once stole a Tiger on Orel and saw a Panzer II swinging out of a main road. I fired, dead right behind the turret. Doesn't even show damage. I fire once more, it takes it out immediatly. Maybe it was the same thing, that nobody wants to use the tankettes, so they made them more durable.

Re: Accuracy of Mobile 88s
 

No... Thats called network latency.

Re: Accuracy of Mobile 88s
 

or for stupid people like me its lag

Re: Accuracy of Mobile 88s
 

Network latency, yes.

Re: Accuracy of Mobile 88s
 

I don't know about any sort of actual inaccuracy, but it does seem to drop much more than the stationary 88mm does.

But that might be the fact that on maps where 88s can win (Storm), those cannon are used at close range, whereas the Sd.Kfz 7 with flak 36s are generally used to snipe tanks at long range.

I personally used one very effectivly on Aberdeen last weekend. Hartmund was there, he did a bang up job too.

Re: Accuracy of Mobile 88s
 

Any weapon that relies solely on kinetic energy to take out a target would simply punch a hole in any light vehicle it shot at... like a bullet through a sheet of paper.

Heres a more applicable example: imagine firing a high velocity tank round through the side of a minivan with little if any damage to the drivetrain of the vehicle. Sure it might get kicked to the side a great deal, but it would still be driveable.

Same idea would apply to a halftrack.

Re: Accuracy of Mobile 88s
 

That's probably it--I use the stationary ones mainly on Storm, Caen and a few other maps, so that may not be representative.

Nonetheless, I still wonder whether the shot drop isn't a bit much--the Flak 36/88 had ca. 820m/s muzzle velocity, while the KwK 36 was ca. 810 m/s (800 m/s with later rounds) and yet it seems to hit way more spot-on at range. I'd be satisfied with someone telling me I'm just on crack, and the two weapons are coded exactly the same (or very nearly); however, I would still think that the mobile 88's hit area should correspond more to the actual gunsight at longer ranges (since it's a vulnerable, hard-to-use PoS otherwise anyway.)

Re: Accuracy of Mobile 88s
 

Um i see :0wned:.

But there are other things, like whats the reason for the far to big bomb splash radius (especially against armored :D )
I guess its so noobs get frags. If not, well why then?

Re: Accuracy of Mobile 88s
 

mobile 88s work just fine to me, and the mobile 88 ownage map is aberdeen. Lots of nice "hull-down" places to hide into. Using "hull-down" + superior range = ownage :D

Re: Accuracy of Mobile 88s
 

I agree, if anyone actually drives that unwieldy and hopelessly vulnerable truck to the point where it can actually do some effective damage, the user ought to be rewarded with accurate shots.

Test it out on empty server is the only thing i suppose.

Re: Accuracy of Mobile 88s
 

I suppose you're right--I've only had the chance to play Aberdeen twice, and did fairly well with the 88 there, so go figure. I'm probably a influenced by the DICE El Alamein, on which there's too goddamm much air for 88s to make much of a difference (plus, on the Eastern side, there aren't really any good hidey-holes for them.)

Stauff: regarding bomb blasts, a 500kg bomb makes a BIG BOOM. Remember that a lot of damage to tanks has nothing to do with actually hitting and penetrating the tank armor, but causing enough of a "WHAM" against the thing to generally screw it up, set off ammo, knock a piece off the inside that pings around like shrapnel, whatever. Or at least, rip a chunk off the tracks.

Re: Accuracy of Mobile 88s
 

Maybe because the gun is mounted on a mobile platform it is slightly less accurate that on a fixed base. You do get a lot of recoil when you fire that puppy, kind of like the Sherman, which I can't hit squat with. Wouldn't that tend to reduce the range / muzzel velocity a bit?

Re: Accuracy of Mobile 88s
 

No. Muzzle velocity is simply the speed at which the shot exits the barrel. For an identical weapon/round mounted on any platform, this will be the same. Range ditto.

There's not really any recoil per se transmitted to the carriage on the mobile version.

Re: Accuracy of Mobile 88s
 

They're probably less accurate because of mobility. Parking on an odd surface will move the vehicle and off goes your aim.

Re: Accuracy of Mobile 88s
 

Good point with the AP-shell passing through light vehicles. The sherman-crews are said to have experienced this in asia. In the few armored engagements there were, american tank-crews soon shifted to HE, as their regular AP often made no more than dual 75mm vent-holes in the tincan-armor of the Ha-Go and its likes. Japanese tanks could even be taken out using a BAR with AP-munition. Back in Europe, german gunners experienced some of the same, as thinly armored western allies added to their targets. A typical WWII AP-round has a better chance of disabling a tank if it gets to disperse its energy inside instead of passing straight through.

Re: Accuracy of Mobile 88s
 

Speaking of Mobile 88s, what happend to the deployable one?! I know it was not very noob friendly (took me about a month to figure out how to fire without killing myself), nor was it very mobile (had a turn radius the size of El Alamein). However, once I figured it all out it seemed alot more useful for defence,with its smaller profile, than the current one. For example on storm it was very effective when deployed on the frozen river, hiding the truck portion behind the bridge. Deploying it also seemed to keep it more steady than the current one allthough deploying on non level ground somtimes proved problematic.

(There was also the risk of having a less knowledgeable person hop in and attempt to fire the gun while you were towing it around.... resulting in 2 dead germans.:0wned: I know I was the less knowledgeable person in that situation more than once *ftk plz*)

I am no expert on the matter but I think the old style was also alot closer to the way germans moved their flak 18s around.

http://forgottenhope.bf1942files.com...owableflak.jpg
(pic taken from 2003 archives http://forgottenhope.bf1942files.com/main.php?module=archives&selectedmonth=12&selected year=2003〈=english )


Just realized I forgot to search but I am confident it has not been asked yet... What kind of mobile arty will we hope to see in FH2? Will we see any deployable arty? Or are there only plans to keep the current system for mobile arty?

Re: Accuracy of Mobile 88s
 

I liked that old flak truck but in any other view but first person it lagged like an sob.

Re: Accuracy of Mobile 88s
 

I don't know if it's been fixed in 0.7 as I've not tried this since, or if it would even be considered a "bug", but it used to be possible to hammer people inside bunkers just by hitting the outside wall with an 88 in AA mode. The mobile 88 on Tobruk was fantastic for this--you could stay out of the firing angle of the bunker windows, and just rack up kills like a madman.

As it stands, 88s in AA mode are fantastic for wiping out infantry in confined areas such as Berlin streets. You don't even have to hit close to them--just aim at the nearest wall. If you're playing Axis, and you have reasonably competent people defending the right-hand passageway to the first flag, the 88 (maybe with 1 guy helping out) can defend the left side almost single-handedly until it runs out of ammo.