Getting a new video card
 

Alright, I'm getting a new video card probally tommorrow. What's a good video card(I currently have Gf4 Ti4200 64mb card) for about 100-150 dollars with 256 mb RAM. Do I need to do anything special to switch from a NVIDIA to an ATI card?

Re: Getting a new video card
 

ATI Radeon 9600xt

Re: Getting a new video card
 

the only thing new u need to switch are drivers thich come with the card

Re: Getting a new video card
 

Howdy...


First up, you dont need 256 Ram.Get a Radeon 9800 Pro with 128 MB and you´re way better off than with the 9600.

If you change from Nvidia to ATI, youll have to delete all the old Nvidia drivers.


JW

Re: Getting a new video card
 

got a new geforce fx 5900 ultra from gainward last week. it has 256mb ddr ram and u can play fh with 8x AA and 8x AF with all details maxed very smooth. i ahve payed 299€ for this baby and it was all worth it.

but if u only wnat to pay 100-150 dollars then get a 9800 pro ati (like JW said), cheaper and better than the 5700 nvidia.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

My recommendations

1) Click on this link, scroll to bottom of first post and click on the .jpg

2) Find your card on the list. Compare to the other cards on the list.

3) Go to newegg.com and see what the cards you are interested in sell for.

The game used to achieve these benchmarks was BF1942:SWOWW2 so yes I do think its relevant.

I am looking at a Powercolor 9800SE with 256 bit 128MB .

Others will say dont get that SE's suck. But look at the chart, the 9800 SE scores within 4fps of the 9600 XT. You can get a 9800SE w/256bit data path for around $158.00. The 9600XT sells for about $163.00

Not sure where you can find a 9800Pro for $100-150, everywhere I looked they go for between $215 to $300

From here is just conjecture, speculation, and personnel opinion.

There are several guys that have installed a softmod that turns on the other 4 of the branch pipelines giviing a boost in performance, then overclocked it. The benchmark scores were within 2,000 points of the 9800 XT.

This entirely depends on whether you want to overclock. It is not advised unless you know what you are doing and understand the risks involved.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

What link, Anlushac?

If the 9800SE is beating the 9600XT and it's 256bit(not MB...that's different) then that's a good buy...

I wish 9700Pro's were on newegg. Does anyone know what is the equivalent of the 9700Pro? Is it the 9800SE?

Re: Getting a new video card
 

1) Go ATI. nVidia is making the same mistakes the 3dfx was making a few years back.
2) Changing gfx card manufacturers only requires changing drivers. I recommend unloading old drivers first, though (this isn't actually necessary, but it makes life somewhat easier once the new card is installed.
3) For that price range, I recommend the Radeon 9600XT, which range in price (depending on manufacturer) from about $160 to $210.
4) Sapphire offers the 9800 Pro 128 in OEM trim for about $240; it's damn near identical to ATI's reference card, if you're willing to indulge.
5) Currently, the 9800 Pro 256 and 9800XT are overpriced and really only suitable for spoiled children and people with far too much idle cash.
6) Last, but certainly not least, ATI's 'Pro' and 'XT' variants are generally better suited for gaming purposes than 'All-In-Wonder' or 'SE' variants.
Those are, of course, my opinions. Take twice daily with salt.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

Well I'm either going for 9800 pro or (if it is cheap enough) geforce fx 5900 ultra like Topgun said. I have 512 RAM and 1.5 ghz processor,would the card still help?I only get like 58 or 60 fps on BF,and like 40 in FH. I also want this card so if I get BF:V,it won't be laggy.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

DOHHHHH!!!!

Forgot to post the link.

http://www.gamingforums.com/showthread.php?t=115579

And ordinarily I would agree that the ATI SE cards are not as good but the 9800SE with the 128MB of 256 bit memory is not giving up a whole lot other than 4 of the 8 pipelines are shut off in software. The softmod turns them back on.

I do not advise getting the 128 bit memory version. I have passed on the 9600SE as a replacement for my GF2MX400 in my 2nd system exactly because it is crippled with 64 bit memory.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

256mb is exactly a good idea, it costs quite a substantial amount more than a 128mb card and usually uses lower quality RAM.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

Yeah but guys, Im looking in the price range of 100-150,alot of these things are like 230 bucks.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

9800SE is $158.00 from NewEGG but make sure you get the 256 bit memory version. The Powercolor one is the one Im looking at.

I will be purchasing it to replace my dying Ti4200-128MB that is suffering from heat damage when the cooling fan quit last fall.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

Get an ATi 9600pro or 9800SE like Anlushac said.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

In that case... yeah.
I'm throwing my vote in for either a 9600XT (yes, these can be had in--or at least close to--that range; I paid $160 for mine) or a 9800SE.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

The 9700 Pro's are running neck and neck with the Nvidia 5900 ultra and slightly better than a standard Radeon 9800.

The overclocked and softmodded 256 bit Radeon 9800SE's are running about same as a Radeon 9800 Pro some less some faster.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

Odd results I think when testing my system with FRAPS.

The link I posted to the vidcard reviews was a P4 3.2GHz with 512MB DDR RAM, and a Nvidia 5900. Toms used FRAPS and BF1942:SWOWW2 to get their comparison results.

Their system showed hte Ti4200-128MB ran about 90.5 fps

My system is a AMD XP2200 Thoroughbred with 512MB DDR333, and a Ti4200. I am running on average about 99-100fps.

If i am running the same fps as the P4 3.2GHz system doesnt that mean the graphics card is running as fast as it can and even if you put it in a 4GHz system its still gonna max out around 100fps?

Prokhorovka runs great at about 85fps in the IL-2 until I go to strafe the german base with cannons and rockets. It drops to about 15 fps.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

Dude, I suggest you to wait until the new Nvidia and ATI stuff is released (end of May), since then all previous cards get a lot cheaper.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

Well its winded down to either anything in the 9800 or 9600 chipset or an NVIDIA Geforce FX 5200.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

FX5200 Ultra yes. Do not get anything that has 64 bit memory, It will run like its has had its balls cut off, cause it has.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

lol i have a 64 mb card.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

One good advice. Never go with ATI.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

Frogging..

64 bit. Not 64MB

64 bit is the data path of the memory. Radeon 9800/Geforce FX 5950 use 256 bit memory, Radeon 9600/Geforece FX 5600 uses 128 bit, radeon 9600SE and low end fx5200 use 64 bit memory.

64MB or larger is fine as long as the datapath is 128 bit or larger.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

A GF4 4200 runs better than an FX5200 :\

Re: Getting a new video card
 

The FX 5200 ultra run a wee bit faster than my Ti4200 but it is also more expensive. But if your gonna get a card your going to want it to be DX9 compatible for HL2 and Doom 3.

I played HL, Opposing Forces, and Blue Shift and I cant wait for HL2. Just what I have seen so far leave me breathless.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

From what I see FX5200s are cheaper than most 4200s...

Also, I think you're wrong on the 5200 being better than a 4200. Take a look at this:

http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.html?i=1797&p=6

Re: Getting a new video card
 

This has nothing to do with the grafx RAM size.

There is no game right now released that uses more than 64 mByte Grafx RAM on a card right now.


The only things, important are:

RAM interface (should be 256 bit on newer cards like 9800Xt or 5900 Ultra, GF4 has 128)

Core and RAM clock.

And this is the 5200 weakness.

It can do all effects, but has no speed (too low clock).

Re: Getting a new video card
 

Get the 9800 Pro if you've got the cash for it. It's (IMO) the best bang for your buck there is! I play 1024x768 with everything jacked and FSAA and ASF Cranked!

Here is a chart showing all the video cards and their scores in BF1942. Just pick the one that has the performance you want and the price you like.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

The 9800 Pro is definitely the best performance for your dollar available on the market right now. I don't have one, but I do have the 9700 Pro, and I play BF1942, FH, and BFV at 1152x864 with everything maxed and I never have any problems at all. Best investment I ever made was pitching the NVidia I had and buying this ATI card. My gaming experience has been remarkably improved since then...

Re: Getting a new video card
 

If you guys read the thread he is on a budget of $100 to $150. If he had the money Im sure he'd try to buy the 9800 Pro or XT.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

All he has to do is go to a compusmart and trade in his old card. In the long run spending an extra $50 to get the 9800 Pro as opposed to a 9600 varient is really worth it!

Re: Getting a new video card
 

The 9800Xt isn´t the big hype anymore.

IF money would not matter, it would be the Gainward Powerpack 1800 GS.
http://www6.alternate.de/html/nodes_info/jagw09.html

It is the fastest graphics card for home user right now. A FX 5950 Ultra.
Actually the clock rates are 50 Mhz higher than shown there, so it has a 555 Mhz Chip and 1050 Mhz RAM clock. It also features watercooling.

When Microsoft releases DirectX 9.1 (or better 9.0c) they say that FX cards will get a 60% performance boost.

So I suggest wait until the new era of cards is released and save some mor money, until this baby only cost 250$ or less. Then buy it!

Re: Getting a new video card
 

And supermodels will jump out of your computer and give you lapdances!

In order to get that kind of performance increase Jesus himself would have had to code the drivers! Whenever a company says that drivers are going to give you an XX% increase it's always prudent to divide it by 4, nvidia or otherwise!

Besides by the time that's even 1/2 affordable PCI express will be the industry norm.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

who said anything about a 9600? And where is compusmart never heard of them?

Re: Getting a new video card
 

Uhm... yeah, move.
nVidia builds cards with really nice specs that don't perform worth a damn. Sure, those cards have got really nice, high numbers... but if they're all that hot, why did nVidia go and optimise their drivers for a higher 3DMark03 score? The simple fact of the the matter is that nVidia has been making that same damn claim for the last three years now ("just wait until [technology X] is released, then you'll see!"), and they've failed to deliver on any of them yet. Unfortunately for nVidia and their supporters, both the FX5950 and the Radeon 9800XT perform well beyond what any game currently needs, but the 9800XT is both more efficient and produces better image quality. And at 95fps, that's all you'll notice.

Anlushac~ I've been touting the 9600XT, but Blistex makes an excellent point... if you can get the price driven down on a 9800 Pro, that's definately there you'd want to put your money. I just can't bring myself to ditch old hardware.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

Would it be so easy that we could all have 9800 Pro's. I sure wouldnt turn one down.

If you go back and lookat one of Blistex's posts there is a link to a .jpg of different cards running BF1942:SW0WW2.

The test machine was some high end P4 with 512MB RAM and was running FRAPS to show the frame rate.

The highest end ATI card was the Radeon 9800xt. The best Nvidia card was a Geforce FX 5950 ultra.

The difference was 7 fps. I dont consider that a significant difference when they cards were pulling down over 200fps.
The 9800XT scored 212.1
The 9800Pro scored 209.6fps
The FX 5950 ultra scored 204.9 fps.

My point is that this is a real world test using a game we all know. And the performance was comparable. The 9800 Pro did not leave it smoking or walk all over it. You would not be able to see a difference of 7 fps in a game running over 200 fps

Re: Getting a new video card
 

And the moral of the story is... the top end video cards, despite their cool factor, are horrible values and should not be considered unless you've either got a corporate credit card or a very rich family.
Also, once you hit about 80fps, additional gains in framerate aren't particularly noticeable. Certainly, 5fps (when running in excess of 200fps) won't make any difference at all.

In all honesty, the "midrange" gaming offering from ATI--the Radeon 9600XT--will run FH with 6xAA/16xAF at 1042x768x32 @ 85Hz and all video options maxed at a fairly consistent 90-100fps, hence my advocacy.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

Being that the 9800Pro from Newegg is $90 cheaper than the FX 5950 Ultra I would get the 9800Pro but if your a diehard Nvidia fan I dont think your giving up a whole lot performance wise. Pricewise the ATI is a better buy.

I have stated before in the past and on another thread that I will go for the best performance in a set price range. For high end the 9800 Pro is a good buy. But since the original thread starter stated he wanted to keep at $100-$150 I was pushing the 980SE since it has 256 bit datapath and performs almost even with the 9600XT.

In my paticular case I would still go with the 9800SE over the 9600 XT since I think it has better overclockability. Yes I know overclocking is bad and evil but sometimes I just cant help myself.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

How a card does in the bf1942 engine is important here.....so here is a test that did that (source : www.tomshardware.com)

Btw : They noted nvidia cards had strange huge drops in fps while doing a sudden turn in bf1942. As the former owner of many Geforce cards and still of a GF 4600 ti ultra i can say i recognise that happening with nvidia cards.

I need a new graphics card too, but because FH and BG42 are the games i play most i am reluctant to buy a Geforce again and still have that sudden turn huge framerate drop.....

Is there any owner of top segment nividia card that can say the doesn't happen anymore with the latest nvidia cards ?

http://picserver.org/view_image.php/BYFM1YUX73HB

Re: Getting a new video card
 

Not so fast!

1. It´s not only a matter of the grafx cards, but of their support.

Right now the ATI are better, because computer games still use 24-bit shaders, which Nvidia cards, do not have. Instead nvidia cards can handle 32-bit shaders which are a big difference to 24-bit (at least for an grafx designer). If the game developers switched to 32-bit shaders ATI needs a new lineup of grafx cards.

2. Further some of those nice benchmarks, which put nvidia down featured pixel shader 1.4, which is ATI only and not supported by Nvidia. Nvidia uses either 1.3 or (FX) 2.0 or even 2.1 (the newer stuff). Anyway ATI has been really active in "cheating" and corrupting either by not only optimizing their drivers (which still suck as BFV proofs), but by those unfair benchmark specs and they gave a lot of money to valve for their Halflife 2 hype. It´s just like policy, it´s all about money.

And DirectX 9.0b is far not optimized to Nvidia.

There were quite some interviews about it and yes, DX 9.1 or better 9.0 c will boost Nvidia cards greatly.

AND 9800Xt may be faster in general, but the fastest Grafx card currrently is and Nvidia card. This one:

http://www.gainward.com/c-2.html

Or also this one. The picture shows the watercooler.

http://www.gamestar.de/tests/grafikkarte/13842/

That framerate drops came with the 1.45 patch. Before that I never noticed any kind of framerate drops.

So this should proof that this is a matter of coding and not about the performance of those cards. DX9.0b is dipshit anyway as 9.0a has been.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

Alright, I want the bottom-line.WHICH ONE SHOULD I GET?!?

Re: Getting a new video card
 

Read the thread! Make a decision!

If you've got the money get one of the high end cards, if you don't have the cash get a lower or mid range one!

It's not my money on the line, it's yours! So you have to make the final decision on what you're gonna get.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

Froggin~ Radeon 9800SE or Radeon 9600XT. Flip a coin. Or just listen to Blistex.

Move~ You're not listening.
1) nVidia has been optimising their drivers in order to pull down higher scores under 3DMark03. That is, they have been writing their drivers specifically to perform well in the tests that 3DMark03 uses, ostensibly to proclaim that they have better benchmarks than ATI.
2) Gainward builds spiffy cards, they always have. I don't think anyone has denied this, but just because the card has watercooling doesn't mean it's a good performer; it means that it puts out a lot of heat.
3) I don't know where you're getting your information, but ATI's 9800 line uses 2.0 pixel and vertex shaders. Does this give them an advantage? Sure! Do nVidia cards perform any better right now, on the promise that "next year's batch of $500 gfx cards will be better?" No, but that's exactly the strategy that nVidia has been relying on since ATI released the 9700 Pro.

Allow me to reiterate the key point in the "Which card is best for me?" debate: The raw technical specs of a graphics card as the sole means with which to "test" it are only useful if you're a bench racer. If you actually play games, then in-game performance trumps all. When nVidia starts producing cards that run fast and look good all at once (like ATI does), then they'll have a leg to stand on. As it stands now, all they're doing is playing a halfassed game of catchup.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

I give you a general advise, not a specific card, but a general advise.

Always by the flagship of the previous generation, when the successors are released.

When the FX series came I waited 2 or 3 more months for the MSI Ti4600-VT2D8X (best GF4) to drop below 250 € (actually it costed 190 € when I grabbed it). Wait for the "king to be dethroned" and then get him cheap and wait for the next generation to get obsolete.

With the flag ship of every generation you can still play all upcoming games very well until you can buy the next good card for cheap.

And you are not reading.

2) Gainwards 1800 Gold edition is test winner. And at many tests It surpasses even the ATI cards in performance. Check the mags.

3) Yes, both GF FX and ATI 9500 and higher use pixel shader 2.0, but the Halflife2 benchmark ran with pixel shader 1.4, which is ATI only. That´s why Nvidia ran like crap on it. And ATI does not have a clean shirt either. They are also faking and manipulating very much. Also remember a benchmark is worth nothing. It does not actually tell how good a game will run. You will only know how good a game runs on your system, when you test it yourself.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

sorry, double post

Re: Getting a new video card
 

I used to be a big Nvidia fan back during the days of GF 1 and 2, but after what they did to 3DFx I decided that they didn't deserve my money! (they waited until 3DFX was playing catch-up and then started a lot of rumours of benchmark cheating, then launched a bogus lawsuit claiming that 3DFx was stealing their technology, essentially 3DFx couldn't afford to fight Nvidia in court and they went under).

Nvidia has made a science of starting rumours, slinging mud, and making huge claims. If they just made cards and forgot about the smear campaign like ATI and Matrox then maybe they would get some of my hard earned cash!

As it stands, they make decent cards that are a little overpriced in some respects, but instead of closing the gap with better hardware or software they instead try and discredit ATI with lies.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

You have a point there and a really good one. I also liked 3DFX (My Elsa III was best). I even kept her over a RAGE TNT or GF1.
Anyway, ATI started the war now along with Valve, being pushed by ATI with at least 10 million dollars.
I liked ATI for coop with Nintendo (the gamecube has an ATI/Nintendo grafx chip called "Flipper"), and I was going to purchase one of there cards, but not anymore.
First I also thought they would be right, but do to the facts that their cards sucks at HDR, are in reality not as advanced as ATI (not compatible with 32-bit shading), and still needed to be patched in games often (Enclave looked like crap at a system a friend of me has) I do not intend to buy anything.
They should have brought their stuff witout falling into the same niveau, as Nvidia had in 3DFX times.

Re: Getting a new video card
 

http://www.compusa.com/products/prod...460&pfp=SEARCH eh?eh? *Satisfied look on face.Then head explodes for no reason*

Re: Getting a new video card
 

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProduc...102-286&depa=1

only a bit more than $200 now

Re: Getting a new video card
 

Col. Weissman Froggin has stated that his budget is $100-$150

For that price I still feel the 9800 SE is the best buy. But it has to be the 256 bit datapath version.

This is the card Im getting.
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProduc...131-236&depa=1

Man that Toms Hardware GFX card comparison is getting around lol