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Re: Barack Obama, should I be worried? O___O <shivers in corner> |
Re: Barack Obama, should I be worried? You could post a so talented text but less machist...nevermind, it's a lost battle |
Re: Barack Obama, should I be worried? ****** Jum Jum, I haven't thrown up in disgust in a long time, but damn, you just made that record dissapear. |
Re: Barack Obama, should I be worried? Coming from an American high school student who has more than a weak, passing interest in world affairs, let me tell you this: By far the most worrying thing to me, more worrying than possible presidents, the details of a massively bloated war, or whether or not McCain would assassinate himself first night in office, is the complete hell it is to find a real sense of whats going on in the world. Everywhere you expect to find information like this is filled with a deluge of carefully designed, processed, canned, and certified information that has passed through at least one filtering group (left/right, this/that, whatever). I can get a better glimpse of the war from random vids on liveleak than hours of CNN, et al. And thats barely a glimpse. As far as politicians go I have no friggen idea what anyone really stands for because of how artificial everything surrounding them is. I understand they're politicians and that means they traditionally wont be entirely open, but when the bit of info they actually reveal is run through the aforementioned system, any meaning is lost. I go to school and have things to do in my life other than spending hours trying to dig up info on a candidate who seems almost indistinguishable from all others. To lead a "normal life" I have to rely on someone else to develop my opinion of who our next president should be. Most of the people I know at school will talk about how much they hate Bush or love Obama, but when asked why, or to elaborate, wont be able to say much more. maybe they just picked up on the spill over from the flow of popular culture, I wonder to myself. But the only real difference I can see between me and them is that I put no faith in anything I see or hear having to do with politics. None of us really knows the candidates or what they stand for, or what that means. Some of that is just lack of experience in the world, but a lot of it stems from this wall of twisted and convulted information standing in front of us and understanding. Maybe I'm being too much of an alarmist about an issue that has faced civilization for eons, but with the sheer size of the world these days, I think we have it worse. At the inception of the US the population was something like 4 million. It is now over 300 million; A little over half the states have more people living in them then the entire US in 1776. Maybe breaking up the power will fix things, eh? No...no not really. Seems the only pure democracy is anarchy. |
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Not to mention that there is a big difference between a simple gaffe or pronouncing something differently than others do and taking a play book from the Clinton campaign plan of making incorrect, outrageous and easily confirmed statements in front of audiences simply to score points with them knowing that it will be OK b/c no one except the "kooky right-wing conspiracy machine" will ever call you on them. |
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Re: Barack Obama, should I be worried? ^^^Kommunist!!!^^^ |
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He hit the essence of it when he stated that: "As far as politicians go I have no friggen idea what anyone really stands for because of how artificial everything surrounding them is." Bingo, bingo bingo... There are so many forces in the background of each of these candidates, each vying for a stake in the American Pie for whatever their sorted reasons are. That they truly care about the American people and what is best for them? Bulldonkey... They care: #1 about themselves #2 pleasing their financial backers And for those of you who like to rail about "big corporate money" ruining politics these amount pail in comparision to the George Socerous's of the world. Nice little dollars trickling continuously into Barak's campaign when supposedly the USA economy is so bad and gas purchases and travel are impaired? No sorry. The common man doesn't hate the Republicans so much but the big money backers do. I like the idea of cleansing the political house and starting over. I have thought so for many years. +1 rep if I can do it..... (disabled but I gave it anyways...) |
Re: Barack Obama, should I be worried? It's "George Soros", but that's the only error you made. ;) |
Re: Barack Obama, should I be worried? Scott McClellan, should I be worried? |
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Point #1: Scotty was forced to resign (i.e. fired) for being an incompetent idiot who couldn't do his job nor handle the press. Right, no ax to grind there. Funny how Ari Fleischer - another former Bush press secretary - got virtually no mention of his book when it was published. I guess he didn't say anything the media liked. Point #2: Scotty was routinely vilified by the liberal left for being a lying mouthpiece of the administration - funny how they all want to have him be the father of their children now. Point #3: The media have routinely ignored tell-all books about the liberal left, particularly the Clintons, for years - even when those books have shot to the top of the bestseller list like old Scotty's has. And even when liberal darling George Stephanopoulos cast an unfavorable light on Bill Clinton in his book "All Too Human: A Political Education" he was called a "turncoat," a "backstabber," and an "ingrate" A far cry from the standing ovation Scotty boy is getting. Point #4: Scotty's publisher, Perseus Books Group, publishes the work of far left authors almost exclusively and is closely tied to George Soros - in fact, they've published six of his books. So yeah, no agenda there. Point #5: And -this is a big one - George Bush isn't running in November. All of this focus on Bush by the Dems and the media will be what will vault McCain into the White House come November. Kind of like the old military adage of "fighting the last war". So come Tuesday we'll all be back in Obama/Hillary primary land and everyone will have forgotten about old Scotty and his 15 minutes of fame. |
Re: Barack Obama, should I be worried? Well, if to be an incompetent idiot would be a reason to be fired in the Bush Administration he should fire everybody and then fire himself, don't you think? =p Talk about predictable all you want, but the fact is you are very fast posting irrelevant crap about your enemies and very slow for self-critic, the McClellan issue should be a very interesting debate theme, but your mouths were very closed in the hope nobody would bring it to the table |
Re: Barack Obama, should I be worried? So sweet to see you guys alienate each other. I'm looking forward to see you playing together in a squad next time.:D If you ask me, it doesn't matter who wins. So many things have been done wrong in the last 8 years, it will take more than a decade to recover the losses. And if Bush is really going to bomb or attack Iran in August, it might bring another setback for world economy. Bush tried to put off peak oil to a later date, but as we see he failed and things went into the other direction. Note that the world is currently talking of Bush, not of the U.S. as the bad boy. Bush and his policy harmed worldwide reputation of the States, and that is just another reason why every jumping jack seeks for his opportunities to cause trouble as the world is at variance. Unfortunately there is no real culture of critism in the States. Mentioning the things you don't like about a country is a big 'no-no' in the U.S. and among its citizens, only appropriate to harden the frontlines. And here is the reason for U.S. media failing in its role it should serve in a democracy. At least that is the result of discussion going on in foreign and european media. Media did not tell people the truth, but acted as a servant of the government. This is quiete hard to understand for the outsiders, but comes along with the fact that critics, especially in wartimes, are a 'no-no' again. Its just that many things the U.S. do, are of public interest here and have been discussed intensely within the past years, which might not have been reflected properly in U.S. media, but caused people to get a stabilized idea of the situation on their own. So, whomever you vote, things can only get better. And maybe there will come the days again, when US exchange students don't have to justify themselfes for being americans or have to explain, that not every american is a bush sympathizer to make others treat em less like an alien.;) |
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Re: Barack Obama, should I be worried? Dukat, I think you've missed something about this thread. The USA DOES foster LOTS of "culture of critism." What we're complaining about on this forum is the media lying to us from the CRITICS standpoint, NOT as it were the government's standpoint. I've noticed this a lot from some forigners. They seem to think that here in the USA there is little to no critisicm of the Bush admin, the war, or such. The media here does nothing BUT critisize the government, mate. And most people too. Hell, if you've listened to us, even those of us who support McCain, the war, and such, still attack Bush for how he handled the aftermath, how he's handled immigration, and other things. I attack McCain for his fervent belief in global warming hysteria, and attempt with the democrats to ban freedom of speech for certain political bloggers. |
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This discussion is about the upcoming election. Once again, Bush isn't running in November, nor is anyone from his administration. In fact, McCain is a vocal critic of the Bush administration. Scotty's book is about as relevant to this discussion as a book about Bill Clinton's administration would have been in 2004. |
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It seems my attempts at subtle humor continue to miss the mark :(... |
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In fact, I heard something last week that I have to agree with. CNN and its mainstream buddies are actually reporting the news like they would to its friends across the waters, not to its USA constituents. To make it a litttle plainer, that means a hatred/bias of the USA is totally acceptible. There is a misconstrueing of news but it is always to the negative of the USA image - always. If it wasn't for them having to pay the appropriate lip service for what occurred on 9/11 it's no telling how much more the USA public would be railroaded down the Goebbels path to a good old one world mindset. Scott Mc and Mr. Bush - my guess is that he had someone (leftist) ghostwrite his book. He wasn't doing as well financially as his predecessors at that illustrious position and just (in a campaign season and not 2-3 years ago) happen to feel a bit like Hemmingway. But let's talk about a very strategic mistake in politics as a President and it doesn't really matter what party you belong to: why do you let "liberals" (if you are conservative or visa versa) anywhere in your organization? This can be the State Department, CIA, NSA, DOD wherever? Why? To let them spear you all along the political path that you have to travel for eight years and beyond? Not very good Art of Warish if you ask me. The sad truth is probably because you are only a little bit of Liberal yourself. There are worst reasons but none that normal mortals can prove. And the crux of the issue is that the USA "Conservative"/Republicans have compromised us out of a Newt Gringrich power base into utter worthlessness with three people running for president that are just different shades of blue. It seems like the principles that propelled Ronald Reagan into two landslides victories don't seem to have appeal for our Conservative "leaders" even though they still reasonant strongly with the rank and file today. Scott McCellan will end up standing by himself come new year because after the elections, he wil be disgarded as the temporary tool that he is. |
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Re: Barack Obama, should I be worried? McCain did criticise bush his policies , from 4 years ago to about a year ago... but now he almost completely streamlined the little policies he has with what bush has , and thats why its being called the 3rd bush term.Bush his endorsement is part of it. About the guy and his book, you can doubt whatever motives he has for writing it, but it doesnt make it less true , its nothing new what he writes , it just confirms what we knew from the very start , and no one even in the white house is trying to deny what he wrote , everyone is just "puzzled" as to why he did it. And about the citricism part, wasnt it only a few weeks ago that one member on this forum told the other he shouldnt critize his own country... dont remember the quote.Its when i brought up that "patriotism" is used by the citizens to keep other citizens in check. Right now alot of media is critizising the bush administration rightly so, even though you could prob link me one case fox news critizises bush, i could show you a million cases where they dont and flat out lie. This still is high contract with 2001-2003, where you were a terrorist(i was called this more then i can remember :) ) for being critic back then, to give an example of the mindset of back then , Freedom Fries. The whole media was in it too, only Bill Maher and Keith olberman stood up against it. |
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Nothing more nothing less. But I got to give it to the man McCellan. I mean to stay in a job he absolutely destested with people he mistrusted and had to portray their lies to the American people for six long years is more than I could do... BTW, that remark was sarcastic. |
Re: Barack Obama, should I be worried? You are a pretty good Bullshitter Knight. |
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Nothing...new =p |
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Unless you can quote him saying that, there is no need to write is only you trying to wish what he felt and did. Now instead of making up stuff , the truth can be found easely through the means of the internet where the exact answer is given to what he did in those 6 years , how he felt about it back then , and why he wrote the book by himself. (on the right side you will be able to select the succeeding parts to watch) Opinions are just that , opinions , and i usually dont care about opinions, i cant make anyone like a red car while they like blue cars, but do not lie about, doubt or twist the facts , as long as we agree on the facts im fine with whatever you or anyone else feels about anything. |
Re: Barack Obama, should I be worried? Ah, Presidential Elections, a time for wannabe politicians to show their true colors as star debaters. A time for us to poor up a tall glass of stout, and yell at eachother until one side is out of words. Arguments over people that will eventually end up breaking their bands of "trust" and exposing their lies one step at a time. We just might be better off letting children sit in the oval office, and sign the Declarations of War. Americans nowadays over rate the elections, no longer are they "who's the right choice" its, "who hasn't slept with 15 college girls" or "who is good to his wife and kids" or "who could win in a bathing suit competition". Bill Clinton slept with women on the road of Hillarys campaign? I don't blame him, would you want to bang a chick that wears a suite every day of her life, and probably recites ammendments in her sleep? Barack Obama has a freak priest that he claims he never went to, and who the American people don't like. But, lets be frank, is not every priest like this? Pressing religious beliefs and values on you and your familys into giving the church hundreds of dollars over the course of a lifetime? How is a Catholic Bishop any different from Obamas Priest? You must still bow to him, and kiss his ring, and that makes him less of a problem? America won't have a good president, until the American people can pull their head out of this pile of dog-shit that is this modern world. Who gives a damn if celebrities broke up, or who gives a damn that Britney Spears was on drugs, or that John McCains Medical Records were *gasp* released for 3 hours. WHO GIVES A DAMN. Honestly people, the same thing happens to people all around you every day, why must you get your fix by turning on a television and critisizing those that have entertained you? Or who are to run this country? Barack Obama, Hillary Clinton, George Bush, John McCain, any of these people could be a pot smoking, drunk, who never goes home to see his/her kids at night, is thinking of divorcing his/her wife/husband, and has gone to 55 mental rehab centers in the past 60 years. I DON'T GIVE A SHIT, if they can and WILL make the right decision, why must all else matter? |
Re: Barack Obama, should I be worried? +1 and rep given. |
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Yes, this thread is about the upcoming election. Last time I checked, Obama is the presumptive Democrat nominee and Huckabee is a former Republican candidate and still a possible VP choice for McCain. How is this not about the election? |
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And as for it being true at all, I'll leave you with this: Scott McClellan Originally Planned to Attack Media, Defend Bush | NewsBusters.org Although today his book is being touted by left-wing reporters and pundits, his initial plans for the project show former White House press secretary Scott McClellan intended to take a much different approach, one that was more sympathetic to President Bush but also quite hard on the "liberal elites" of the Washington press corps and their "hostility" toward the administration. Reading through McClellan's original book proposal, obtained by Politico.com, it is clear that before his editor Peter Osnos took the book on a sharp leftward turn, McClellan wanted to turn the tables on foes in the press gallery including far-left columnist Helen Thomas and NBC correspondent David Gregory. |
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Hell, I could write a book like McCellan's - I've heard this crap for so long. To me it's just a case that some people think the more you repeat something falicious the more it is hoped it is accepted as truth. As far as "pulling stuff out of my ass" my observations are based on summarizations of multiple conservative talks shows that have documented the hell out of their statements. And for Liberals to claim they can document anything as true is an oxymoron. Can you say "it depends on what the definition of is is"? |
Re: Barack Obama, should I be worried? left right nazi democrat blabla , opinions are opinions , facts are just that , facts , there arent left or conservative facts. So you are saying what he wrote in the book isnt true ? about manipulating ? lying ? its stuff we knew for a FACT was this way from DAY ONE , at least everywhere but the usa it seems, what makes this book different is that its the first time someone from the bush administration directly admits it. That book could be a print of some LEFTISTS LIBERAL BLOG with the guys name on it, it wouldnt make it less true, you can believe what you like, but if you really think what he wrote wasnt already common knowledge and if you really think its not true , then guess what its just you cause not even the current administration tries to deny it. He could do it for the money , he could do it for the truth to be known , he could do it to get back at them , he could have just copy pasted some blog , could be schizo , be on a bad acid trip , pretended to like bush to write a book about it later , i dont care and it doesnt matter , truth is the truth, and it seems no matter what you dont want to believe it. |
Re: Barack Obama, should I be worried? Have you read the book? Do you have any specific facts and their proof to lay down on us? |
Re: Barack Obama, should I be worried? No Stefan you are so wrong in this one assumption - just because something is written it is true. Think about what you are saying - anyone on a blog (on the Absolute Truth Internet no less) writes something, Scotty can copy it and it is still true? There is a little thing called motive that has to be considered and then the resulting cause and effect of an act. You may be the most honest of people Stefan on the Earth and would never lie in your writing but what makes you think this tactic is not politcally expediant for others to use? Things are written spoken in lies and half truths all the time just to see if the concept can gain some sort of life and force a political edge. But here is the real truth: "So you are saying what he wrote in the book isnt true ? about manipulating ? lying ? its stuff we knew for a FACT was this way from DAY ONE , at least everywhere but the usa it seems..." It's called hatred of Bush and correspondingly the USA. When you say "we" I assume you mean your fellow Europeans. Thank you for your honesty. What I wouldn't want to admit is how easy you'all (insert favorite country/countinent here) are mislead by a lying media. Don't feel too bad though because a good portion of our own country has drunk the koolaid as well... Most of the Conservatives on this forum have gone out of our way time and time again to point this out the fact that major media in the USA and the World has a slant to the left and it has been very successful. However (and we will dance around this) a person believes what he wants to beileve mostly to keep himself comfortable within his mental/emotional self. |
Re: Barack Obama, should I be worried? living under a stone for the past 7 years ? too much fox news ? let me ask you this , do you not believe what he writes or just calling me out to actually have to copy paste some more for you. aka do you believe bush never lied or manipulated the american ppl. |
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You didnt read what i wrote , its not true cause of being copied of whatever , its true cause it has been proven to be true already outside of the book. do i really need to give examples ? ( did you not notice no one is claiming he is lying , even the bush admin themself ) |
Re: Barack Obama, should I be worried? What if Mccellans book is completely true? |
Re: Barack Obama, should I be worried? Yeah, right here. I'm asking for examples. Quotes, statistics, anything that can be sourced to What Happened and something to substantiate it. |
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Let's see - 1) Bush used propanganda to push the war in Iraq. The root of this is the assumption that Bush lied about WMDs. So old, so warn out, so mistated. Every intelligence agency in the world had this assumption at the time of the conflict. Every one. Show me one (non-Arab) that thought different. Or did they think anything (or even care)...? 2) Hurricane Katrina and aid to New Orleans victims was a massive government failure. The US government only acts in conjunction with being asked for aid from the state involved, in this case Louisiana. It has been showed that the governments of New Orleans and Louisiana were so inept in their role that was the real cause of this situation, both in asking supplying and asking for aid as well as the initial funding to secure the damns about the city. The voters of Louisiana overwhelmingly voted out that governor and replaced him with Bobby Jindl, a very Conservative Republican. The fact that these two mainstream Democratic talking points are cited reflect strategy and motive as just trying to dovetail on established "truths". 3) Carl Rove & Scooter Libby lied about roles in Valerie Plame Rove quote Hannity & Colmes: ROVE: He says that following a meeting Scooter and I visited in 2005. Well, Scooter and I visited all the time. I don't know what the particular meeting in question was about. I know what it wasn't about, which was it was not about Plame and Wilson. He was the vice president's chief of staff, and, as a result, we had a lot of business, and I think it's frankly maybe a sign of irresponsibility for Scott to sort of suggest that because he saw the two of us meet and he didn't happen to be in the meeting he somehow knows what the meeting was about. http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/spc.gif COLMES: What about this specific charge that he's claiming that you misled him about your level of involvement in the Valerie Plame case? ROVE: That's simply not true. Hannity then piped up and said, "If he really felt this way, why didn't he leave earlier?" ROVE: This doesn't sound like Scott, it really doesn't, not the Scott McClellan I've known for a long time. Second of all, it sounds like somebody else, sounds like a left-wing blogger. Second of all, you're right, if he had these moral qualms, he should have spoken up about them, and, frankly, I don't remember him speaking up about these things. I don't remember a single word. There were people on the White House staff, colleagues of mine, who had doubts about this or that policy -- COLMES: We're out of time. ROVE: -- they spoke out, but this doesn't sound like Scott, frankly. 4) Voicing concerns in the White House to the President: Francis Fragos Townsend, who was the homeland security advisor, now a CNN commentator, was on CNN, Anderson Cooper 180 last night and he asked her this. "What's your reaction to the Scott McClellan book?" TOWNSEND: People need to understand that as an advisor to the president I or Scott have an obligation, a responsibility to voice concerns on policy issues. Scott never did that on any of these issues as best I can remember and as best I know from my White House colleagues. COOPER: Never spoke out? TOWNSEND: No. And so for him to do this now frankly strikes me as self-serving, disingenuous, and unprofessional. 5) President Bush never governed but campaigned. This is coming after a Clinton presidency that was nothing but campaigning, legacy and subterfuge over sexual relationships while in the White House and governorship in Arkansas. If anything Bush never said enough and was under constant critiscim by the press without rebuttal, contary to another McCellan book claim. Bush's own party (myself included) insist that the bigger politcal principles were ignored and that is why the election now stands where it does. "Nuff said. Even to you American-hating Euros :) Also - there are inconsistancies in the book when Mr. Bush is referred to as "the president" and other times when he is referred to as simply "Bush." Ghost writer perhaps? |
Re: Barack Obama, should I be worried? Knight, aren't you doing the same thing? Saying all liberals believe everything is true, sure whatever. But you're basically believing everything that is written bashing the current administration. I could grill you with the same quesitons your asking Stefan about why you know it's not true? And you have just as much proof as somebody trying to explain why it is true. |
Re: Barack Obama, should I be worried? Not to interrupt, but there's a huge pre-scandal brewing, presumably about Michelle Obama's participation on some radical panel and some supposedly shocking comments she made. Look for a video tape to emerge within 24 hours: Doug Ross @ Journal Assuming there is some truth to the rumor, the way for the Obama camp to play it is to float rumors hyping the hell out of it, so that when it comes out, viewers will think, "That's no big deal." They may already be doing that, since speculation is that it's so terrible Obama will be crippled; he can't recover; he'll drop out within a week, etc. Pretty strong stuff. I'd look for Hillaryland's fingerprints to be all over this leak. If it isn't that big a deal, and Obama sails on majestically, this might sink her chances for VP. This is not good for McCain, since he will beat Obama. Hillary is another question. |
Re: Barack Obama, should I be worried? No I don't believe everything about the current administration and honestly have changed my opinion of Mr. Bush as of late. There are many things I choose to criticize but this is the difference: what are the Liberals willing to say that is good with this administration? Anything? Dare they? A constructive critcism is pure gold to an open heart. You can quote me on that if you want.. :) But there is an attitude, a spirit dare I say, a constant drum beat of how all things all the time are all wrong and there is no hope until the administration changes. There are no real solutions offered up but just criticisms and these are usually self-serving. But when it comes to believing certain sources over others? Yep, I've got them and it's because I have lived a few years with them and they are the closest thing to my beliefs and what I feel that is best for the country. |
Re: Barack Obama, should I be worried? I bet it's not true Jummy lol, I bet you guys want to believe it, just like Knight is accusing everybody of believing the Mcceallan book, you guys are going to believe rumors about Michelle Obama. Both sides believe things they shouldn't, don't think it's any different. |
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A racial comment I believe. Twill be interesting....but to me, not surprising... |
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Re: Barack Obama, should I be worried? I never believe fox news though, my guess is this turns out to be false, time will tell. We can comment on it in several hours or so whenever it's supposed to be revealed. |
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Re: Barack Obama, should I be worried? I think I figured it out. Michelle Obama, is reverend wright. Only thing that makes sense. |
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