Was von Stauffenberg really this short?

[LIGHTNING [NL]]

The German government isn't stopping them from making a movie, they have only banned him from shooting at military sites. Stauffenberg is somewhat of a national hero and I fully understand that the German government does not want to assist in a movie in which he is portrayed by an American scientology weirdo.

Tom Cruise is also one of the movie's producers by the way.

[{SmB}IcelanDick]

Originally Posted by Admiral Donutz

I have to agree with scientololy not being recongnized as a religion by the German goverment but what does that have to do with the making of this film? I mean, if I believe in the religious order of the "holy micronesian camel krops god" why should that stop me from making a movie?

Unless they didn't got permission for other reasons and the above reason is just a cry for attention...

this camel god you speak of appeals to me and I am willing to pay to hear more



Seriously, it's surprising how many countries recognize Scientology as a religion. I was disappointed to learn that Canada recognizes it as a non-profit organization, of all things. I guess that's better than it getting religion slash charitable organization status, but still...

[Real-BadSeed]

I gotta say, i really dont like the idea of someones personal beliefs determining whether they are allowed to work somewhere or not.

Thats goes against freedom of choice, and i cant support that in any way.

[MrFancypants]

The problem is less the personal belief of Cruise but rather the possibility that Cruise uses his fame, which he gains through movies, to manipulate people into joining a sect.
I'm not surprised that the German government decided not to help him with that.

Originally Posted by jumjum

Still and all, what a delicious turn of events: The family of a WWII Wehrmacht soldier say that Tom Cruise is too weird and perverse to play their relative.

You are aware that you are implying that everyone related to a Wehrmacht soldier is weird and perverse?

[jumjum]

Originally Posted by MrFancypants

...You are aware that you are implying that everyone related to a Wehrmacht soldier is weird and perverse?

Nope, I'm implying that there were enough WWII Wehrmacht members with unclean hands that the idea they find Tom Cruise unworthy to play the lead in Germany's postwar passion play (Berlin as Obergammerau, the failed Plot as the passion, Stauffenburg as The Postmodern Germanic Christ) is perversely funny for several reasons, a few of which are: 1) Tom Cruise creeps out guys who, say, fought on the Russian Front; 2) Guys who, say, fought on the Russian Front, some of whom doubtless were very happy to have the world look at the SS instead of the Wehrmacht, see no irony in pronouncing anyone morally unacceptable for anything; 3) the seeming desperation of some in Germany to claim Unsullied Hero status for Stauffenberg, and their need to have the world now believe that they would have been with him all along; funny in that Stauffie was, as most heroes, a mixed bag (see above), and that it's amazing how The Plot failed, or even how Hitler came to power in the first place, since there now seem to be so many people who opposed him. Those examples of human foibles I find funny.

[Meadow]

Have to agree with Jumjum, the only good thing I've seen him do is Collateral, which was actually a very good film considering it's still a Hollywood blockbuster.

Still, I am taken aback by the Scientology thing. I despise Scientology, don't like Cruise that much, am totally against the film, but think it's a little off to disallow filming because of membership of an organisation (it's not a religion). Considering Germany's history of banning organisations, and indeed the subject matter of the film, I'm sure the bastards at Scientology will have plenty of ammunition to hit the media with about this.

[Lobo]

Scientology is not a religion, it's a criminal gang organization with these goals: to get the money of poor persons in bad shape, terrorize them if they try to escape, and has as secundary bad effect to put their lives in risk with their mad pseudo-medicine.

I think any promoter of that criminal bullshit deserves a tar and feathers treatment, gladly dealt by any righteus mob, with or without wehrmacht ancesstors. And more if he/she is a third file actor, bored with all that sex (well, maybe not Cruise), drugs and techno'n'roll life, so he/she searchs excitement in stuff with hidden side: scientology, budism, taliban vegetarianism and other hippie business

[Coca-Cola]

I think you're all being a little too hard on Tom, he's dyslexic...he doesn't really know what he's getting into.

[MrFancypants]

Originally Posted by jumjum

Nope, I'm implying that there were enough WWII Wehrmacht members with unclean hands that the idea they find Tom Cruise unworthy to play the lead in Germany's postwar passion play (Berlin as Obergammerau, the failed Plot as the passion, Stauffenburg as The Postmodern Germanic Christ) is perversely funny for several reasons, a few of which are: 1) Tom Cruise creeps out guys who, say, fought on the Russian Front; 2) Guys who, say, fought on the Russian Front, some of whom doubtless were very happy to have the world look at the SS instead of the Wehrmacht, see no irony in pronouncing anyone morally unacceptable for anything; 3) the seeming desperation of some in Germany to claim Unsullied Hero status for Stauffenberg, and their need to have the world now believe that they would have been with him all along; funny in that Stauffie was, as most heroes, a mixed bag (see above), and that it's amazing how The Plot failed, or even how Hitler came to power in the first place, since there now seem to be so many people who opposed him. Those examples of human foibles I find funny.

Ok, just sounded a bit like it.

As for your other arguments, most of the people who fought on the Russian front and are still alive are probably too old to care about Cruise, the people who do care have never fought in any wars and they never shared in any of the crimes that were comitted during the second World War.
You're probably right that Stuaffenberg's family wants to portray the conspirators in a very good light, but even if all of those conspirators weren't as innocent as some people may think, they still risked their lives for a good cause.

I also don't think this movie is intended to overplay Germany's dark history, because that would imply that today's Germans consider themselves to be in some way guilty for a history they had no part in.

[Fuzzy Bunny]

We could get Madonna to play the part. That way we'd piss off Argentina too.